- ETI 018 The Heavy Ball
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One of the most common phrases in tennis today is ‘hit a heavy ball’. So what is a heavy ball?
The incoming shot “feels heavy” when that shot has a lot of momentum.
Generally heavy shots are produced with a combination of racquet speed as well as body weight “against the ball.”
But (as always) there is more. In addition, I believe it has to do with perception. If the player times their racquet acceleration and weight shift – the appearance is of minimal effort – and that cue often surprises us when the ball arrives heavily.
Whereas when the player leaps, grunts, and whips the racquet – those cues may more readily help us to identify a ball arriving with significant momentum.
Heavy balls feel like they shoot through the court, seem to have more pace after the bounce, and often produce late or defensive replies.
Want to hit heavily (hold on here what follows is old school) – bring your body weight and racquet against the ball.
Let me know what you think…
47 Comments
Greg Reneau
September 30, 2013You almost have it right but I want to offer something I’ve felt or experienced which leads me to another theory. I believe the ball itself actually absorbs and retains energy. In other words a ball that is hit hard by a very strong person is going to go over the net with that person’s strength transferred to the ball and that ball has more pent up energy than a ball smacked very fast by a small weaker person. When the haevy ball hits the ground or the opponents raquet on a volley, the energy releases and is transfered to an explosive bounce back in the other direction.
I developed this theory partially when I started to notice that a guy who’s heavy spin hit my raquet got some of his own spin back when I returned his shot.
Bottom line, I think the ball actually absorbs and retains energy and that energy is created by the strength and power of the hitter.
Just look at a real powerful man swinging very slowly at a golf ball the travels 300 yards where the clubhead speed of a small guy might be much faster, their is no power.
Jim McLennan
October 1, 2013Greg – maybe – there is something to placing your weight against the ball – but equally at the driving range often slender young women can out drive the men – ??
Jim
Franco
June 5, 2013IMHO (in my humble opinion) the sweet spot has nothing to do with it. No modern pro hits it in the middle of the racket anymore, that was back in the day of flat strokes. And even Jimmy Connors, who arguably had the fastest flat shots in tennis, did not hit a heavy ball – super-fast, yes, but not heavy. Zing rather than Whoomp. Heavyness, in my opinion, comes from RPM, the more topspin the heavier, but also from trajectory: if I hit wicked topspin on a ball but the trajectory is low, barely skimming the net on the way to the bounce, it will not feel heavy on my opponent’s racket. If on the other hand, my trajectory is more arched, and dips in at the end, that ball with jump out of the bounce and make my opponent’s racket tremble in his hand. And since high rotation can only be achieved with very fast pronation of the forearm, I don’t see how it can be achieved with a “slow” arm. Maybe an arm that accelerates, yes, but it has to accelerate like a F1 Ferrari…
Jim McLennan
June 5, 2013Franco – this was conjecture on my part – many talk about the feel when receiving a “heavy ball” and it does have to do with spin, with speed, with cues from the opponent and more – when I played at Cal many years ago our number one player hit very heavily – then I saw him play against Bob Lutz from USC and the heaviness was reversed – so this may be a perception thing
Jim
jules
May 8, 2013I had a good day today and noticed that I was hitting the ball hard but with less effort both on forehand and backhand.
I was wondering why was I suddenly hitting the way I did 15 years ago, with little effort but lots of zip and came to the conclusion that it was because I was totally focused on the ball and did not look where I wanted the ball to go.
Jim McLennan
May 9, 2013Jules – great note, there is magic in this watching the ball thing – really magic
Jim
Shawn Seattle
August 20, 2012Good explanation of the mechanics of the heavy ball. I was always blamed to hit heavy balls on the server and on the down-the-line shots. I thought it was due to a) head-heavy racquet and looser strings, and b) hitting the ball flat in the sweeter spot of a midsized racquet.
I agree with your explanation but I’d also like to add that there could also be some amount of slip and slide factor when the ball is struck flat. I noticed it more on the indoor pickleball courts where the ball slides off the court at a higher speed than it had travelled over the net.
Brian Copeland
August 9, 2012I think you hit the nail on the head Jim. It seems to happen when I keep a loose or lighter grip. Also I seem to keep my arm loose and swing fast but with less effort.
Thanks for reminding me, this happens on ground strokes and serves.
Brian Minnesota
Danny Cummings
August 9, 2012Hello again Jim,
I suppose that power (the heavy shot) is lost by using poor technique “especially timing” and body poor weight transfer to the racquet.
If you think about it a tennis racquet and tennis ball are oozing power already.
It’s what we do with it that matters.
Phew at last a brief message from yours truly.
Thanks Jim
Danny
Robert in Hawaii
August 6, 2012The heavy ball, let’s talk about 3 quick things.
Very old school: Hugh Stewart (former David Cup USA man and Diamond Head Player) tells of Don Budge’s backhand being so heavy that when Hugh was a top 10 U.S. player, Budge could knock the racket out of his hand when he tried to volley-and this was when Budge was a senior and much after his grand slam.
Second, the hybrid grip of the semi-western so that the heaviness can be achieved by a player transitioning from top-spin to a flat and hard,heavy stroke vs. the safer top. The drive and the punch come from the slight grip change and getting your full weight behind it. Heavy and keeps them off-balance.
Third, the ball that looks like it is going to hit the fence and suddenly dives for the baseline and at your adversaries shoes. This is a great one to hit if you got it. And we certainly hope that like the great Brian Cheney, you would call that ball good and admire your adversaries shot.
Speaking of Brian Cheney and the heavy ball, as many, many on the losing end of battles with Brian can attest to, this player seems to hit the heaviest ball in third sets and in tie-breaks. That is Chandler/La Jolla heavy.
Walter
August 6, 2012Heavy ball is something difficult to describe, but every time you experience it, you can tell it for sure. I use to practice with a girlfriend of mine, who is very talented with hitting heavy balls. She is a thin girl, but has a perfect timing. Everytime she hits she looks as relaxed as possible and her arm and raquet swing don’t look particularly fast. She doesn’t even bend her knees, but the ball is always coming fast at you and at the bounce it just explodes toward the back of the court. There is no way of knowing this in advance other than the fact that after a while you realize that every ball she hits is behaving that way. Those balls are not necessarily pumped up with top-spin. In fact they are quite flat, but damn they are heavy! It feels like trying to catch a missile with bare hands. I got to play with skilled men, and I rarely had this feeling of heaviness. Furthermore, that perception always came with the player using brute force.
I think the explanation for this is perfect timing, hitting in front and putting the bodyweight on the ball. One more thing is relaxation while swinging, especially of the hand holding the racquet.
I thank you Jim for providing the best (by far) coaching tips on the net.
Walter
Jim McLennan
August 6, 2012Walter – thanks for the note, the thoughts on timing, and on my efforts
Jim
Bud Light
August 5, 2012I think as usual that you make a very good point. People tell me that I tend to hit a heavy ball and yet I know I don’t swing that hard. I do try to provide some momentum on my followthru but I am not sure myself if this is what makes my returns “heavy” or not. Yet what you say makes all kinds of good sense. Best, Bud Light
Richard McDonald
August 5, 2012I feel that when I make the effort to utilize my abs in hitting that I can achieve the “heavy ball” feel on my strokes.
Shmuel Goldberg
August 5, 2012Can you swing slow and hit hard? If all you do is swinging the racquet by your arm, no way. But if you know the physics of a tennis hit, it is possible.
Just create rotation in a body that possesses a significant momentum of inertia (your body) and transfer this rotation to a body that possesses a much smaller momentum of inertia (the racquet). A slow rotation of your body creates a fast rotation of your racquet according to the law of preservation of an angular momentum. A fast racquet makes a fast ball. A light fast ball possesses a significant momentum, equivalent to that of a heavyt slow ball. So the player on the receiving side feels hitting a heavy ball.
Anthony Aces
August 4, 2012Hi Jim, I find many people can hit hard, but a true heavy hit is obtained with a fluid swing with a full follow through and the body weight going forward, making full use of the legs.
Fred
August 4, 2012There’s heavy and then there’s real heavy. Real heavy balls have lots of spin as well as ball speed. The spin contains addition rotational momentum that must be overcome AND controlled to make a decent return. To further complicate things, a heavy top spin ball must have the topspin momentum completely reversed to be returned with a topspin ground stroke. There’s other issues with flat and slice returns. If that isn’t complicated enough, small variations of spin intensity and rotational axis can be hard to read and deal with consistently.
This is where the term/feature of ‘pocketing’ comes into play. String sets and tensions that give a good pocketing feel help grab and control the heavy balls to allow quality heavy ball returns.
Jim McLennan
August 4, 2012Fred – I like the term pocketing – wonder if that is related to the loose string beds presently with the copoly string
Jim
Mario Marelli
August 4, 2012Hello Jim,
In response to Zac, you are correct. Although P=MV,its not about the mass of the ball .Its more about the force that is required to bring the ball to that velocity.
Think of a wrecking ball as the sweet spot on a wracket head.
An example could be a 100 lb wrecking ball on a cable swinging into a brick wall at 30mph.
Contrast that with a 500lb ball swinging into a brick wall at 30 mph.Which wall looks worse after impact?
Since F=MA a tennis ball struck with a 400gram racket swung at 50mph would have more momentum than a 300gram racket .
Having said i still think that I still think that the heavy ball is more about RPM .
I remember studies at the time claiming that Pete Sampras ‘s serve was over 4000 RPM while Andre Agassi’s was 2500 RPM.
Lets keep this thread alive , I would like to hear more opinions because there is no greater satisfaction than being able to consistantly hit the “heavy ball”wether its the forehand , backhand serve volly etc. and if someone could demystify its nature we would all benefit from that advice.
Jim McLennan
August 4, 2012Mario – thanks for the note, especially the word “demystify” for to my mind this is about both reality (physics) but also perception
Jim
Zac
August 3, 2012Hi Jim ,
Momentum is mass times velocity, right? Since the mass of the tennis ball stays the same, saying that a shot has more momentum is the same as saying it’s faster, isn’t it? The same thing would be true when you talk about the momentum of the racket head, I think.
I think you’re right about the psychological factor, because I can’t see any other variables in a moving tennis ball other than
1)trajectory
2)speed (before and after bounce)
3)spin
Would love to hear more about this from someone with a physics background.
Anyway, thanks Jim!
Jim McLennan
August 3, 2012Zac – thanks for the note, check on books by Howard Brody – including Tennis Science for Tennis Players – he may describe this better
best
Jim
renman
August 3, 2012I hit a heavy ball intermittently, while my focus has always been consistency and placement . I think your comments will give me something to work on ! thanks
Mario Marelli
August 3, 2012Hello Jim,
I would like to second the opinion of Bill Troiano when he refers to the mass of the Pete Sampras racket as being a critical factor in the generation of that illusive “heavy Ball” which I define as a super charged particle brimming with kinetic energy ,cutting thru the air into the opponents court causing his wrist flex backwards in his futile attempt to counter act the force of the projectile you just launched.
From my own experience , I used to play with the old Dunlop Max 200g . The strung weight of the racket was about 400 grams. I routinly hit so called heavy balls with that racket. My opponents would tell me so and I could feel the energy as th e ball left the strings. Over the years I have experimented with dozens of rackets ( all of them lighter and I might add “stiffer”) but I have never been able to reproduce that sensation of that power and raw energy that I felt with the Dunlop.
Its not about the speed of the ball. Its about the quality of the rotation. My guess is that more mass gives you better quality of rotation.
Jim McLennan
August 3, 2012Mario – thanks for the note, I have bags full of old Dunlop 200g an the wood precursor the Maxply – brings back old memories
best
Jim
Sally
August 3, 2012Thanks Danny Cummings,we’ll get in touch when we want to become musicians .
Danny Cummings
August 3, 2012Hi Jim,
Yes I do think about the percussion aspect of my hitting because there is nuance and within that there is information , it’s feedback that comes down the racquet the same as it does through the drum stick.
In a slightly abstract parallel I started to think of the tennis ball as being the tip of the drum stick and the string bed as being the “drum head”.
The most “bounce back” is found in the middle of the head where the trampoline effect is optimal but out nearer the edge of the head is where a lot of control is to be found and where the most delicate “buzz rolls” are played or subtle ghost notes and so on.
Because of the lesser trampoline effect nearer the edge you can get the stick to dance tirelessly with absolute control.
I’m still assimilating all of this, it’s early days so it may only have limited mileage but when serving in tennis recently, I softened my grip right off as I started to hit up on the ball to create topspin and I found that just slightly higher up the string bed, nearer the top edge, came a whole lot more accuracy.
I have been told by a couple of opponents that the ball is now more awkward and consistently heavy to deal with. I have also begun to try this with my ground shots and found a similar result.
To my mind the so called “Sweet spot” on the racquet as on the snare drum may vary according to what it is you require of your racquet but I find that a brutally struck tennis ball usually returns very disappointing results
The soft grip seems to be partly the key as with the drum stick it facilitates what drummers know as the fulcrum effect which means that the stick does all the work not the wrist.
If you want to see this in action then watch the late Buddy Rich in full flight, that’s the fulcrum effect!!
Maybe this sounds too far fetched to some but a free moving drum stick or racquet is better behaved than one which is gripped too firmly.
I have just out of interest put a link here to an expert breaking down Buddy’s stick technique and the relevance of all of this to me, is not that far removed as it may seem.
Kind regards Jim
Danny
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0jLlUAXSA0&feature=related
Noushin Kananian
August 3, 2012Many thanks for sharing your invaluble knowledge.
Raj
August 3, 2012Jim,
Heavy ball analysis is nice.
Roger and Rafa hit very heavy balls and balls jump off the court.
Back in 80s Ivan Lendl hit a very heavy ball but that was a kind of ball shot through the court.
How do you compare the heaviness here ?
Thanks!!
ej
August 2, 2012I’ve been enjoying your videos and I hope getting it. “It” being something I can take to the court.
Thank you.
My comment re the heavy ball analysis –
It seems to me that the arc is a factor. A ball with a low arc or flat trajectory, hit hard, and even with topspin, does not have as much “heaviness” as a similarly hit ball which has more arc (higher trajectory).
I like your notion re the sound of the hit.
Hear this, Below is I think, a new thought.
I have recently started to wear hearing aids and I find that they help my game !!!
Better Q’s. Hearing the opponent’s hit, hearing the ball the hit on the floor.
And yes, I think you may have something – your own hit tells you lots by it’s sound.
TY, aka Tennisyoda, aka Gene Lee, aka EJ
Don McD
August 2, 2012Heavy balls are definitely not an illusion. I have known individuals who hit a heavy ball consistently. I believe that you get a heavy ball by contacting the ball early in your stoke with an extremely light grip. Additionally, you hit the ball on the bottom portion of the racquet, not the sweet spot. Since your hand is pronating at contact, the bottom portion of the racquet is actually pivoting away from the ball so there is little or no collision with the ball. Additionally, although the racquet is not moving very fast early in the stroke, it is accelerating very quickly. This allows you to impart more energy to the ball and to impart it over a slightly longer period of contact. This is quite easy to do on the serve, but much more difficult to do on groundstrokes. If you get the timing perfectly it feels as though you sling the ball in rather than hit it
Rodger Schuester
August 2, 2012Maybe I’ll upload some video of that underhand sidespin serve, as well as my (work in progress) kick serve soon.
Bill Troiano
August 2, 2012I had the privilege to hit with my all-time favorite tennis Pete Sampras in 1994 in Philadelphia, PA. It was during the tournament in Philadelphia that Pete always played because it was the place where he won his first professional tournament. Later that summer, Pete won his first Grand Slam title at the US Open in 1990.
I was able to hit with Pete, as they were doing a commercial for ESPN, and Pete was already there for the tournament, and they asked Pete, Malavia Washington and the Jensen brothers to participate. When Pete showed up at the Riverside Club in Bala Cynwid in Philadelphia, they asked me and another teaching pro if we would return balls to Pete as they filmed him.
I realized after hitting with him just how heavy Pete’s ball was, compared with other pros, like Malavia Washington, who I also hit with that week. Pete used a very heavy racquet, the Wilson Pro Staff, and also put lead tape on it. He used it during his entire career, and this worked well because it meant that the collision with Pete’s racquet was so heavy in meeting the ball that it was more effective than that of others on the tour.
By comparison, it’s like a train going down the track and having a colllision with a tractor trailer truck. The train is going to win every time because of the solid mass. When you take into consideration Pete’s heavy racquet meeting the tennis ball, the end result is the ball coming off the racquet much heavier than that of any other players on tour.
Jim McLennan
August 2, 2012Bill – great story about hitting with Pete – what a memory
Jim
Rodger Schuester
August 2, 2012Not that long ago, a fellow player that I was rallying with wanted to know if he was hitting a heavy ball. I kept telling him the truth, no, and he was pretty upset with me.
I have read the below posts and they seem, to some degree, to be the writer’s best how to do it. In that vein, I read recently that there are five ways to basically “hit” a ball. That the “best’ way was to compress the ball (with your body) and roll the ball forward.
Back on point, I think it is really relative to the receiver. If the ball doesn’t feel heavy to me, it’s not heavy, even if it is well hit. And I don’t know that a poorly hit ball won’t feel heavy…because when I was a beginning 2.5 six years ago, I received a lot of heavy and punishing balls, even from 3.0 players. Lately, when hitting with the 4.0s, I don’t seem to receive many heavy balls.
I’m thinking that when I’m in balance, my hand relaxed, eye on the ball and the ball path, and I’m not surprised at what I’m getting, I rarely receive a heavy ball.
So, you have my vote Jim. And Jim, you don’t get it automatically, you always have to earn it. On the other hand, I don’t remember a vote you have lost yet, but I got my eye on you. 😉
Note: I got that Nadal grip change down for forehand and backhand.
Note: I executed a backhand underhand sidespin serve to the deuce court against a strong 4.0 last weekend and he was so shocked, as well as my partner, that they all laughed like heck as the guy couldn’t get his racquet on it as a first serve, as it went sideways off the court. His swing path assumed a fairly straight path.
Used sparingly in some cases and more in other cases, it’s a lot of fun.
SRC
August 2, 2012Relaxed swing + timing/momentum + body weight movement transfered to ball + sweet spot of strings + topspin motion equals heavy ball.
Topspin allows the tranfer of the other four better than a slice or cut shot.
You can grunt and yell all you want but that has nothing really to do with the heavy ball. Watch the mechanics of the player. Not the grunting or yelling which I think they are looking to ban soon if its too loud.
Danny Cummings
August 2, 2012Hi Jim,
I understand something about the percussion aspect of the shot as I am both a passionate recreational tennis player and a professional percussionist. I wrote to you a couple of years ago about this very subject as I recognised the existence of this parallel.
For better or for worse my understanding is as follows.
The parallels that a tennis racquet and a “snare drum” (for instance) share, are the “sweet spot” “tension” of the drum head or string bed and common physics.
An over struck snare drum will choke sonically when hit with brute force whereas, with a consistent clean, crisp hit in the same spot every time then “the sound” is actually greater.
This suggests a more “efficient use of energy” at least from the drumming point of view and so perhaps with the tennis racquet too.
For the tennis player / drummer, there are less aching joints the following day too.
Best done with the ease that technique facilitates like Federer’s or Kohlschreiber’s backhand for example… Sweet but deadly.
Perhaps where the parallels really cross over is that the sweetly struck snare drum rewards the player not only with a lovely sound but with an “effortless bounce back” of the stick.
Powerful yet energy saving and equivalent to the effect that a racquet has on the tennis ball.
If you insist on slamming the stick on to the drum or crushing the ball then expect no help at all from the drum, the stick or your racquet. An effortful and inconsistent performance and “poor timing”, will be your reward.
Did I really just say all that, apologies if it’s too much.
MTKS has seriously helped my game by the way, Jim!!
Thanks for tolerating my comments.
Kind regards to all
Danny
Jim McLennan
August 2, 2012Danny – I think about this percussion thing a lot – and you have an interesting idea about the sonic aspect – somehow I want to learn more
do you feel anything about the percussion when you are hitting – and yes this may be in some way about the speed of impact and the precise location on the racquet head
please keep in touch and thanks for your note about MTKS
Jim
Norman Ashbrooke
August 2, 2012I had the opportunity to work at the Don Budge Tennis Camp back in 1972. On the first day of camp, I was feeding balls to Don Budge so he could demonstrate his incredible drive backhand to all of his campers. He was 57 years old at the time, and he was still competing in senior events. When I attempted to volley his shots, it felt like a flying brick had hit my racket! His swing was incredibly smooth and effortless, and yet the tennis ball felt extremely heavy. I believe your analysis as to the importance of perception is quite sound.
Sincerely,
Norman Ashbrooke
Jim McLennan
August 2, 2012Norman – thanks for the note – Budge’s coach Tom Stow was all about heaviness, swinging slow to hit hard, and wanting us to “conk” the ball
Jim
Chris
August 2, 2012if a heavy ball is related to maximum momentum at impact, does that mean we sacrifice racquet head speed for body weight into the ball somehow ? Any specific techniques for doing that ?
FWIW, I’ve been trying a subtle down/up motion with my knees, where I bend the knees slightly coming into contact, and just before contact my knees spring up quickly, pushing up off the group rapidly. Makes my leg muscles act like springs, in a way, using the forward momentum of my body and bending legs as energy for the rapid release upwards. The jury is still out on it, but I’ve had some good results where the effort feels less than a regular knee bend ( regular meaning in which there’s no potential energy stored in the bend, as if you had been bending for a longer time and you have to exert more muscle energy to push upwards. )
Bruce
August 2, 2012I’ve found after hitting with a average sized person and a stocky muscular big boned person in the same hitting session there is a difference. The stocky muscular big boned person’s ball is definitely
a heavier ball.
Jim McLennan
August 2, 2012Bruce – maybe, but there are also slender lithe players who can generate these “heavy” balls – somehow with their rhythm and timing rather than their bulk
Jim
sam
August 2, 2012the heavy ball in my opinion refers to a ball with top spin that jumps off the court at a faster linear velocity than it had before the bounce. total momentum is the sum of linear momentum (mass times velocity) and angular momentum ( inertia times rotational velocity). when the topspin shot bounces and transfers more rotational energy into linear energy than the friction from the court takes away, the ball will speed up and affect the timing and trajectory of the shot. the bottom line is the ball comes across the net at the opponent at one speed and angle and after the bounce has a different and higher speed and somewhat altered trajectory.
Tomaz
August 2, 2012Hey Jim, good tips on the heavy ball! We in Europe playing on clay courts are very big on trying to achieve a heavy ball on groundstrokes.
I see the key in focusing all your energy – from your whole body! – into the ball which of course you hit with pace and spin as you mentioned.
The ball is not heavy when one hits it with the arm and doesn’t know how to connect the arm with the energy generated in the body (namely using the ground and rotation).
Mr. Alexis Johnson
August 2, 2012Dear Jim:
When I think about “heavy balls” or when I see them or when I discuss them, I am referring to balls with pace and top spin. When I am playing a player who hits what I would refer to as “heavy” — they are typically playing with a combination of: good balance, good hip and core rotation, ball in front, closed grip, fast yet smooth stroke, brushing the ball — with power — into top spin delivery.
As much as anything, I use my eyes and ears together to pick this up — but its all about the swing and and the effect on spin on the ball. I would not generally refer to a flat or even semi-flat ball as “heavy” though I might refer to it as “hard” or “atomic.”
When I execute a heavy ball, I need balance, good position and shoulder turn, a grip that is closed – say a forty degree brush-power stroke angle, a stroke out front, with smooth and timed hip and core rotation, and, for lack of a better way to say it, a finish that is high (or includes some upward movement as to the ball on contact to impart spin).
“Heavy” is known. It requires, for both the stroker and the receiver (who is the next stroker), a clear eye on the ball and an eye on the spin.
And, knowledge of the habits of the opposing stroker or hitter who hits heavy helps.
Richard
August 2, 2012I read that Pete Sampras hit the heaviest tennis serve ever. This was due to hitting up through the ball (pronating). The spin of the ball was filmed and no one today comes close to that much spin.
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